City Councilors Lydia Edwards (East Boston, Charlestown, North End) and Michelle Wu (at large) say they want to get the T to set aside one car on every Blue Line train for bicyclists who would ride their bikes to work downtown, if only there were a way to get them across Boston Harbor.
The council agreed to let them hold a hearing to discuss a possible bike pilot on the Blue Line after Edwards said that one of the biggest frustrations of East Boston bike owners is the inability to ride it to work unless they work north of the neighborhood, at a time when East Boston roads are increasingly clogged by car commuters.
She added that the company that wants to build a giant development at Suffolk Downs is proposing a massive infrastructure for bicyclists, which will only end in frustration if its users can't go any further than Maverick Square.
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Comments
Great idea!
By cden4
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 2:10pm
Great idea!
I like the idea in theory
By ChrisInEastie
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 2:35pm
but to be frank, and I say this as someone who would 100% take advantage of this: prior to the pandemic, it wasn’t uncommon for the Blue Line to be an absolute shitshow by the time it hit Maverick during the morning rush. And with literally hundreds of new units being built (or proposed and likely to happen) in Jeffries Point as you read this, it’s not going to get any better.
The question is this:
By roadman
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:13pm
Will there be enough bicycle users to justify alotting an entire Blue Line car for them, especially during rush hour?
I actually think there would be.
By ChrisInEastie
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:43pm
At the very least, a pilot would make sense to test demand.
Thank you for being realistic
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 11:30pm
Yes, it would be nice to have a bike-only car. But, it would also be nice to have Blue Line trains that are wider, longer, and can actually fit all the people waiting on the platform at Maverick.
Until the latter happens (i.e. never), it makes no sense to implement the former.
So is one car going to be set
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 2:51pm
So is one car going to be set aside ONLY for bikes? If that's the case, then this makes no sense. You're going to take an already crowded 6 car train and squeeze passengers onto 5 cars?
If they're going to share the one car with other passengers, than wouldn't it make more sense to spread the bikes among all the cars instead of squeezing all bikes on one car?
If only there were some other
By myname
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 7:42pm
If only there were some other way bikes could be transported around... hmmmmm...
Different Car Configuration
By KellyJMF
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 12:18pm
If you set aside a car for bikes, you take out all the seats. More room for bikes without blocking other passengers from getting on and off. And non-bike using passengers will avoid the car with no seats if they know to expect it.
Is it possible
By BostonDog
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 2:56pm
To have a shuttle train that just goes back and forth between State and Maverick? This is in addition to existing service.
I'd hope
By cybah
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:02pm
I'd hope after all the track work in is done.
If I recall, and Im sure I will be corrected. There's cross over tracks just beyond Maverick (outbound toward Airport). I think this was one of the things they fixed or are fixing this year.. the tracks around maverick.
And there's another at Airport but again until Orient Heights (yard). I think the crossing at Airport is more modern and preferred by the T. Still a local train from airport to Govt Center isnt a bad thing either (for airport travelers)
Trains crossing-back at
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 4:35pm
Trains crossing-back at Airport or Maverick block the main line in both directions while they are crossing back, it would actually cause more harm than good from delays in travel time.
Not really feasible with the single track setup
By ChrisInEastie
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:48pm
but would be awesome.
Paddle Boat?
By cybah
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:02pm
I was thinking a water taxi for bikes
But a great idea would be adapt a paddle boat in a way that you could take any bike, snap it in, and use your bike to power the paddle boat across the harbor.
Just make it a 'bike paddle boat' service where it (and the borrowed life savers) would need to be returned to either spot on the harbor.
(not saying having a car on the blue line is a bad idea.. but its amazing that we live next to the water yet other than some inner harbor ferries that have low ridership and water taxis.. we dont use it or promote it much)
in Amsterdam, the bicycle
By LS
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:01pm
in Amsterdam, the bicycle fare is € 1.80. There are concessionary and
long term reductions. Moving bicycles out of the passenger cars is attractive
but, it removes a car from regular usage. A bicycle is the ultimate single occupancy
vehicle and, on transit more than doubles the space occupied by the passenger.
So, the bicycle car has its capacity halved. In most of Europe, the solution is
to provide extensive storage at the key station(s), Maverick? East Boston is more dense and
better served by transit than most places. No one has to drive (or ride bicycle)
unless they want to. East Boston is also not a Bicycle hot spot.
On April 27, 2016 between 7AM and 6PM 17 bicycles passed the intersection of
Bennington & Saratoga Streets. During that same period there were 1333
pedestrians and 25619 motor vehicles.
Key consideration in those
By Adam Pieniazek
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 4:52pm
Key consideration in those metrics is that it's really difficult to bike from Eastie to the rest of Boston. It wouldn't flip the numbers but if there was a way to get from Eastie to Boston via bicycle those numbers would be a lot higher.
Why not let people bring
By anon
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 7:53am
Why not let people bring bikes on, for an extra fare? That makes loads of sense to me. It's not prohibitive, but at the same time it forces the the cycling passenger to offset the impact of doubling the space they take up in the vehicle.
Dumbest idea I ever heard
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:15pm
Another case of people who don't take the Blue Line or the T in general wanting to implement an unrealistic idea. Noble maybe, but entirely unrealistic. Have you ever SEEN the Blue Line at rush hour? There is not even close to enough room for people as it is, and now they want to set aside an entire car for a handful of people with bikes? Completely unworkable. Incidentally it's always evening rush hour on the Blue Line northbound starting at 4:30 PM or so. There may be a little lull around 7:30-ish, but after that it's packed to the gills until closing. And people want to set aside cars? Bad, bad idea.
Perhaps that one subway car
By GoSoxGo
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 6:49pm
could be for everyone, including bicyclists.
You can currently bring bikes on Red, Orange and Blue Line subway cars, except for during rush hours. On the Red and Orange Lines, you could conceivably ride your bike to your destination during rush hour, but that's harder to do (crossing the Harbor) on the Blue Line.
Instead of designating one particular subway car, just allow it on all cars, as long as space is available. Grocery carts and SUV baby strollers take up almost the same amount of space.
Because God forbid human
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 7:03pm
Because God forbid human beings who rely on the T need to transport groceries and have babies that get in the way of your precious-self.
Another option: Use jersey
By cden4
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:48pm
Another option: Use jersey barriers to convert one lane of the Sumner or Callahan tunnel into a two-way bicycle/pedestrian path.
Thats a state road
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:59pm
Will never and should never happen. Also will cyclist be required to pay a toll?
And the Blue Line is run by the state
By Waquiot
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 4:56pm
In the grander scheme of things, they are both a part of the Massachusetts Department of Transportation, an agency the Boston City Council has exactly zero oversight over.
If Wu wants to deal with issues with state agencies, she should have run for state rep or Senate this year. Or, maybe she's grandstanding.
Lobbying the state is useful
By Ron Newman
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 5:00pm
Lynn, for instance, successfully lobbied for the T to reduce its commuter rail fare to $2.40, at least as a pilot program.
True
By Waquiot
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 5:28pm
But the T cares more about what state officials say than what city officials say. Power of the purse and whatnot.
I've heard urban legends of
By Frank O'Solo
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 12:48am
I've heard urban legends of someone riding a bicycle though the Sumner.
That has happened on occasion
By roadman
Fri, 08/21/2020 - 3:28pm
Far less frequent since the exit from the Sumner, which used to dump directly onto city streets, was rebuilt as part of the Big Dig.
For awhile, the big magnet for daring cyclists was the O'Neill Tunnel. At one point, there were reports about once every two weeks of someone riding through there.
Wu grandstanding
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 6:02pm
You don't say. Well that's the council in general, however she seems to be the biggest offender of the bunch.
Also, if cyclists have access to a toll road, they better be required to pay said toll.
Michelle Wu grandstanding?
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 8:30pm
Michelle Wu grandstanding? What planet are you from?
Obviously it will never
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 8:22pm
Obviously it will never happen. Not because it's a state road, but because it's a terrible and wasteful idea.
As Robert Moses
By roadman
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 9:30pm
the one time New York City area highway and bridge czar, once said:
A tunnel is nothing more than a tiled vehicular bathroom smelling faintly of monoxide
As one who rode MBTA buses through both the Sumner and Callahan Tunnels five days a week from the late 1970s to the early 1990s, I can attest to the validity of that statement.
Robert Moses's work was
By Scratchie
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 5:37pm
Robert Moses's work was racist and destroyed numerous neighborhoods in New York. Let's definitely listen to his advice.
Perhaps we could listen to
By Waquiot
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 7:16pm
The guy who rode in un-air conditioned buses very slowly through the tunnels twice a day for years when he points out that a mile long vehicular tunnel doesn’t have the best air quality.
I'd need to do some searching
By Rob
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 9:23pm
I'd need to do some searching before calling Robert Moses racist. He destroyed lots of neighborhoods. I'd be more prepared to believe he hated everyone (except car manufacturers).
...and there's a substantial probability that the Robert Moses answer to this question would be to rip up the rails and replace the Blue line with another highway.
Recommended reading
By roadman
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 9:28pm
Robert Caro's The Power Broker
Oh, yes - he was into power.
By Rob
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 12:07am
Oh, yes - he was into power.
The one time I can think of that he got
outpowered was the Brooklyn-Battery Bridge. The War Department told him to pound sand.
The War Department objected to the proposal for a bridge
By roadman
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 11:29am
instead of a tunnel. But it was President Roosevelt, reportedly at the urging of his wife, that ultimately told Moses to pound sand.
The other time Moses didn't get his way was in the 1960s, when his proposals for a Mid-Manhattan Expressway and a Lower Manhattan Expressway were squashed.
Interesting. I don't recall
By Rob
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 1:06pm
Interesting. I don't recall hearing of any Eleanor angle to it. What was her interest?
The angle that had the ball in the War Department's court, if I recall correctly, was that Brooklyn Navy Yard was a critical asset and that building a bridge (an additional bridge, that is) between the Navy Yard and open water that would be too much of a risk of being targeted & blocking the channel.
...or that was the story they put out, anyway...
Eleanor Roosevelt
By roadman
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 3:10pm
wrote about the issue in her newspaper column My Day after being made aware of it by people in Lower Manhattan about it.
https://www2.gwu.edu/~erpapers/myday/displaydoc.cf...
As for the War Department's arguments against the bridge, they actually had limited merit in this case, because vessels going to and from the Brooklyn Navy Yard already had to pass under the Brooklyn and Manhattan Bridges.
BTW, I have a family connection to the Brooklyn-Battery Tunnel. My Uncle Bob, who lived in Manhattan his entire adult life (except for a stint in the Navy), was one of the lead divers who set the precast tubes used for the tunnel.
A bridge there would have been much better for peds and cyclists
By Ron Newman
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 1:42pm
though that was not likely part of the debate back then at all.
It wasn't part of the debate back then
By roadman
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 3:08pm
But all NYC bridges built in that era, including the Triborough and George Washington bridges included pedestrian walkways as part of the design.
Moses eventually stamped out
By Rob
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 8:30pm
Moses eventually stamped out that design feature for the Verrazzano Narrows Bridge (and the pedestrian walkways were removed from the Bronx-Whitestone Bridge during a renovation/widening, and I guess the Throgs Neck (started in the late 50s like the VZN) never had them).
The Port Authority of NY & NJ now has shared-use paths on two of their three Staten Island crossings - the renovated Bayonne Bridge and the replacement Goethals Bridge.
You are correct. However, unlike the earlier bridges
By roadman
Fri, 08/21/2020 - 5:04pm
the Verrazano and Throgs Neck bridges were specifically designed to serve limited access highways.
Let me help you out
By Scratchie
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 12:21pm
Google "low bridges southern state parkway".
I've been a passenger (and
By Rob
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 1:08pm
I've been a passenger (and later driver) on the Southern State Highway for 48 years (and the other Long Island parkways and the LIE, too), having family in that Suffolk County. Believe me, I'm quite aware of the "keeping trucks away from family leisure motoring" and other tropes that conveniently also precluded commuter buses, making cars more necessary.
(edit) ...and the whole white-flight, suburbia, socio-economic racial dynamic that's tied to it.
Ironically, Moses' parkway
By Rob
Sat, 08/22/2020 - 10:44pm
Ironically, Moses' parkway and car-first focus for Long Island must have contributed to the survival of the Long Island Railroad. If he hadn't precluded having more long-distance commuter-bus routes, ridership on the moribund LIRR would have been even worse. Instead, most of it survives (as part of the MTA).
Good idea
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:52pm
Expect for rush hour. Unless during peak hours the car is open to anyone and resembles the red line cattle car concept.
I know cyclist can be self important _____. However, no way your keeping people without bikes out of the car during rush hour.
Then...
By lbb
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 8:39am
...bicyclists can go in any car during rush hour.
See how this works?
No mask enforcement/No fare enforcement
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 3:55pm
And now you want rules to prohibit passengers with no bikes from riding certain trains. The T can't enforce no smoking, no sleeping, no drinking, no vandalism. Can anyone tell me what rules the T actually enforces.
Agreed
By anon
Wed, 08/19/2020 - 11:25pm
I've been on one too many Orange Line trains during rush hour when the operator yelled "no bikes!" to no avail - the guy got on anyways.
You want an MBTA cop to come
By anon
Thu, 08/20/2020 - 7:49am
You want an MBTA cop to come running and do a flying tackle any time somebody nods off or lights a cigarette on the platform, what a joke. Forget "enforcement". Engineer compliance instead. Clean the damn stations. Staff them with helpful and friendly people. Maintain the equipment. Run service on time. More rent a cops not gonna help anything
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